ROLL BAR REAR BRACES.

[doghouse]

Installing a 8 point cage in my 87.



If i install the roll bar up high against the roof i will have to cut the body above the rear windows to allow for the rear braces. If i drop it down i will not have the 3 inches of head clearance required. Plus if when i install rear braces i will not be able to remove the bed with out cutting them.



Also IHRA says the roll bar must be attached to the frame.



The bar goes through the floor outside the frame rail. What is the correct procedure from this point to connect to the frame?



Any easy ways to install a swing out entry bar that can be removed when not at the strip?



Anybody out there had any experence in installing the roll cage? http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif

[Mike]

http://www.s10v8.com/viewtopic.php?topic=657&forum=10

[basementdweller]

Plus if when i install rear braces i will not be able to remove the bed with out cutting them.



Why would you have to remove the bed?.. Paint? Tape the bars and paint around them.





Also IHRA says the roll bar must be attached to the frame.

The bar goes through the floor outside the frame rail. What is the correct procedure from this point to connect to the frame?



I\'m guessing your talking about the bed? If your talking about the main loop, make sure you have the correct roll cage!!

I cut a 3\" hole with a holesaw and slid a pipe through the frame, welded it to both frame rails...and welded the bars to that, that pipe also helps stiffen the chassis reducing twist. The pipe is hidden by my back tires, this ALSO helps under load for weight transfer, because my shocks are also bolted to the same pipe.





Any easy ways to install a swing out entry bar that can be removed when not at the strip?





use a pin on both ends, make SURE you put the bolt in if u go to the track just to make sure u dont get any heat from the tech\'s.

My trucks in storage I cant take any pics for you but I will see what i have lieing around and scan them in.



Good luck!

http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif



Millenium Yellow Mike

406sb

9:1, mild cam

11.40@116MPH

<img src=http://www.OneSickS10.com/calvin3.gif width=100>

With great power, comes great responsibility.

[doghouse]

Main hoop reply.



Yes the main hoop must go through the floor outside the frame rails.



The rules require that the drivers shoulders must be inside the main hoop.



Since the frame is under the middle of the drivers seat then it has to go through the floor outside the frame rails at least on the drivers side.



Has anybody encountered this problem?



Also are the two front bars required to also connect to the frame?



I also checked the yellow truck pictures and they show the roll bar main hoop being about 4 inches below the roof line. This allows the rear braces to go through the rear window.



The problem with this is you are required to have 3 inches of head room from your helmet to the main hoop bar. To install the hoop bar like the yellow truck you would have to be really short or are sitting on the floor to have enough clearance.





Any help apprecitated. http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_eek.gif http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_eek.gif http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_eek.gif

[basementdweller]

You might wanna check that 3\" rule, obviously in pickup trucks its a little tighter with clearances. No techs have ever said anything about my truck. And i thought the rules want the bar within 6\" of your head to keep the roof crushing your skull. When i sit in that seat with the my helmet on there is about 2\" from my helmet to the roll bar padding.. im only 5\'7\" the only thing i can think of is mounting your seat lower.. when a cage is properly installed you should not see the main loop when looking from one side through the other.. and if hte cage was set back any further we wouldnt have been able to get the welder back there http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_frown.gif as far as the main loop contacing the frame, i cut the top rail of my frame and went through it to the bottom.. welded the loop to the bottom of the frame.. then to the top.. then to the body.. and to the plate. I will look into that 3\" rule also.. thanks for the heads up. no pun intended http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_razz.gif

[basementdweller]

I just dug up the instructions for my roll cage installation. This is an S&W roll cage.. here is what it reads:



B. With the seats installed, and the driver seated with a helmet on, determine the position of the main hoop. IT IS RECOMMENDED THAT THE FORWARD EDGE OF THE MAIN HOOP BE NO MORE THAN 6 INCHES FROM THE BACK OF THE HELMET. Measure from the mounting location on the floor to the roof to determine the height of the main hoop. After the legs of the main hoop have been cut, the main hoop should be trail fitted making sure that the top is level.



According to this... it doesn\'t look like we have anything to worry about...It doesn\'t even to say to consult with the NHRA or local rules and regs. So I think yer safe. http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif

I DO know that an NHRA rule is that any bar that is within reach or can be hit MUST be padded!!



Millenium Yellow Mike

406sb

9:1, mild cam

11.40@116MPH

<img src=http://www.OneSickS10.com/calvin3.gif width=100>

With great power, comes great responsibility.

[doghouse]

AS WRITTEN IN THE IHRA RULE BOOK.



READ CAREFULLY PLEASE



Mandatory in all cars running 11.49 or quicker, or per class

requirements. All roll bars must be within 6 inches of the rear or

side of the driver\'s head, extend in height at least 3 inches above

the driver\'s helmet with driver in normal driving position, and be at

least as wide as the driver\'s shoulders or within 1 inch of the

driver\'s door. Rollbar must be adequately supported or cross-braced

to prevent forward or lateral collapse. Rear braces must be

of the same diameter and wall thickness as the roll bar and

intersect with the roll bar at a point not more than 5 inches from

the top of the roll bar. Sidebar must be included on driver\'s side

and must pass the driver at a point midway between the shoulder

and elbow. Swing-out sidebar permitted. All roll bars must have in

their construction a cross bar for seat bracing and as the shoulder-

harness attachment point; cross bar must be installed no more

than 4 inches below, and not above, the driver\'s shoulders or to

side bar. All vehicles with OEM frame (i.e. pickup truck where body

bolts to framerails) must have roll bar welded or bolted to frame.

Installation of frame connectors on unibody cars does not

constitute a frame; therefore, it is not necessary to have the roll bar

attached to the frame. Unibody cars with stock floor and firewall

(wheeltubs permitted) may attach roll bar with 6-inch x 6-inch x

.125-inch steel plates on top and bottom of floor bolted together

with at least four 3/8-inch bolts and nuts, or weld main hoop to

rocker sill area with .125-inch reinforcing plates, with plates welded

completely. All 4130 chrome moly tube welding must be done by

approved TIG heliarc process; mild steel welding must be done by

approved MIG wire feed or approved TIG heliarc process. Welding

must be free of slag and porosity. Any grinding of welds prohibited.

Roll bar must be padded anywhere driver\'s helmet

may contact it while in driving position. Adequate padding must

have minimum 1/4-inch compression or meet SFI Spec 45.1.



ROLL CAGE{reprint}

Mandatory in all cars running quicker than 10.99 seconds or faster

than 135 mph, or per class requirements. Cars with unaltered

firewall, floor and body (from firewall rearward, wheeltubs

permitted) running between 10.00 and 10.99, roll bar permitted in

place of roll cage, or per Class Requirements. Cars with altered

firewall, floor faster than 11.49 must have rollcage and window net.

All cage structures must be designed in an attempt to protect the

driver from any angle, 360 degrees. All 4130 chrome-moly tube

welding must be done by approved TIG heliarc process; mild steel

tube welding must be approved MIG wire feed or TIG heliarc

process. Welding must be free of slag and porosity. Any grinding of

welds prohibited. Additionally, roll cage must be padded anywhere

the driver\'s helmet may contact it while in the driving position.

With driver in driving position, helmet must be in front of main

hoop. If helmet is behind or under main hoop, additional tubing,

same size and thickness as roll cage, must be added to protect

driver. Main hoop may be laid back or forward, but driver must be

encapsulated within the required roll cage components. On

unibody cars with stock floor and firewall (wheel tubs permitted),

the roll cage may be bolted or welded to the floor/rocker box via 6-

inch x 6-inch x .125-inch steel plates

Unless attaching to OEM floor or frame, the minimum requirements for a

frame member to which a roll cage member is attached are 1 5/8-

inch x .118-inch MS or .083-inch CM round and/or 2-inch x 2-inch

x .058 MS or CM rectangular.

All cage structures must have in their construction a cross bar for

seat bracing and as the shoulder-harness attachment point; cross

bar must be installed no more than 4 inches below, and not above,

the driver\'s shoulders, or to side bar. All required rear braces must

be installed at a minimum angle of 30 degrees from vertical and

must be welded in. Side bar must pass the driver at a point midway

between the shoulder and elbow.

Unless an OEM framerail is located below and outside of driver\'s

legs, a rocker or sill bar, minimum 1 5/8-inch x .083 CM or .118 MS

or 2-inch x 2-inch x .058-inch CM or MS rectangular, is mandatory

in any car with a modified floor or rocker box within the roll-cage

uprights (excluding 6 square feet of transmission maintenance

opening). Rocker bar must be installed below and outside of

driver\'s legs and must tie into the main hoop, the forward hoop,

frame, frame extension, or side diagonal. Rocker bar may not tie

into swing-out side bar support. If rocker bar ties into side diagonal

more than 5 inches (edge to edge) from forward roll-cage support

or main hoop, a 1 5/8-inch x .083 CM or .118 MS brace/gusset is

mandatory between the diagonal and forward roll-cage support or

main hoop.



QUESTION.



ARE THE TECH GUYS EVEN LOOKIN AT THIS?



OR IS THIS FOR ONLY IHRA NATIONAL EVENTS?





http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_razz.gif http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif

[basementdweller]

??????ive never been asked to or seen anyone been asked to sit in the car with their helmet on and ive been to a few national events. It doesn\'t say whether the top OR the bottom of the bar has to be at least 3\" away... I\'m curious why S&W didn\'t put that in their instructions.. personally.. I wouldn\'t worry about it.. if you get heat about it (which will probably ONLY happen if you win some national event).. lower your seat.. or put sliders on yer seat.. when they tech you.. put the seat all the way forward. http://www.s10v8.com/images/smilies/icon_razz.gif

[td7172]

I would say as ong as your helmet is under the main hoop, you are fine. Here is a couple pics, maybe this will help. You will have to slightly trim the area by the back window, I trimmed about 1/4" off mine. Really not hard to install.

[td7172]

Holy crap, this thread is really old!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Should start looking at dates!!!!!